Welcome And Vitruvian Games Win

SPEAKER_02 0:04

Hey everybody, welcome to the Herd Fit Podcast with Dr. Sam Marie and myself, Coach David Stiverton. This podcast is aimed at helping anyone and everyone looking to enhance their healthy lifestyle through fitness, nutrition, and most importantly, mindset. All right. Welcome back to the Herd Fit Podcast. I am Coach David Stiverton. I have a very special guest with me today. I had the director, event director of the Vertruvian Games, which just ended a couple of days ago. I myself participated with Mike Warren. We had a couple girls, Dez and Jess, compete on the women's team side, and Dan Coda competed in the Masters 40 to 44 division. Those were three of, I can't even count how many divisions you guys had, but credit to you guys. You guys ran, uh I told you right before the show, you guys ran an awesome show, home run event. Uh for those that know me, uh, I don't want to say I'm critical, but I'm very picky with you know how how events should run in the cross at space on the comp side. And we've seen good, bad, ugly, been in that game for about 13, 14 years. And you guys did an awesome job. Andrew Raymond, what's up, my man? How are you? Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 1:13

Uh I'm good. I'm good. Trying to catch up on sleep. Yeah. Yeah, I bet a very long week and weekend, but uh it's definitely worth it.

SPEAKER_02 1:21

I'll talk. I've run events before, not nothing to that scale, but I've run comps at our gym. We've run intra gym comps, the open. We make a big deal of uh we did host an announcement in 2023, and I will tell you this that is physically and mentally harder than competing at the competition. You don't even realize people don't realize. I saw you a few times and I was only there in the morning for the team stuff. You don't realize how long you're just on your feet and how long you're engaged. Uh, we have athletes gonna spend a week in recovery mode, maybe work out a little bit, but take a step back from the intensity. What is your recovery like before we really get into your story and your

Recovery After Running Big Events

SPEAKER_02 1:59

why? What is your recovery like this week? I could hear you back at the gym right now, hear some beats in the background. I mean, are you back at it working, you know, your normal your normal job now, or do you take some time off?

SPEAKER_00 2:09

Um, yeah, so pretty much well, I don't want to say I do it full-time, but uh I basically have like four or five different things that I do um outside of the gym, which is technically I would say my full-time job.

SPEAKER_01 2:21

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 2:21

Um, my father's a civil engineer. I do a lot of his drawings. Um, I help him out with architectural plans, things like that. I have a bunch of like private clients that I do um construction documents for. So I get them through permit phase, uh help them figure out what would be on budget, what would be completely out of budget, all that stuff. Um and on the side, I also coach Felician University swimming. I was a swimmer for 17 years. I swam Division I almost made Olympic trials, all that stuff. Uh so I'm helping them out. And then I also do personal training sessions and I coach dry land for the swimmers and wrestlers. So I'm constantly busy this week. I'm not doing any of that.

SPEAKER_03 3:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:03

But uh yeah, recovery-wise, man, this week I I tried doing 10 bar muscle ups yesterday, and I was like, that's it, I'm done.

SPEAKER_03 3:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:11

Today I'll probably take off. Um, and then the rest of the week I was hoping to uh jump into some classes, just have fun with my members and reconnect with the community that helped make this happen, you know.

SPEAKER_02 3:21

Yeah, you know, I bet that's a huge adrenaline dump, but it's also a relief to be at this point where like we did it, and it's funny how fat, how long it takes for you to drum up all the resources and the stress and the thinking and the conversations and the planning and the plan B, plan C. And then all of a sudden, like that, it's gone. It's in the rear view mirror. So before we get into that, Andrew, let's just talk about, you know, you just kind of talked about briefly about what you're doing. That's awesome. Yeah, you get pulled in a lot of different directions. I think that's a cool way to live. You get exposed to a lot of things. And you know, when you're when you're doing stuff like that, how you do anything is how you do everything, and that you can really truly get better at other things while you do something in a completely different line of work because there's always lessons to be learned.

From Division I Swimming To CrossFit

SPEAKER_02 4:01

What got you started with CrossFit? Let's start there. When when and why did you start CrossFit after your swimming career?

SPEAKER_00 4:09

Yeah, so I found CrossFit actually freshman year of college. Uh these guys in the lacrosse team on the same floor as me were watching Rich Froning uh at the games, and that was the event that he fell off the rope. I was like, I won't do that, but I don't want to fall off the rope. Um, not a shot at Rich because he's the goat. But like, um, you know, I wanted to be competitive. I've always loved weightlifting. Um my father had to credit him for giving me the athletic drive of everything, my mother too, but my father's mostly the athletic person in the family. And he was pretty strict and adamant about not lifting before college. Uh, so that's always something I really wanted to do because all my friends were doing in high school. Once I got to college, I ended up lifting a lot. Um, I got uh N NCHS, I think, All American, um, for weightlifting in college, uh, which is pretty weird for a swimmer to get. And then um after you know, junior year, I found a little bit more information about CrossFit. I started diving into CrossFit.com, main site workouts, tried to do them on my own, like body waste stuff like Cindy, things like that. Uh, and then I found CrossFit Love in Philadelphia because I went to school at Drexel University. Got it. Okay. Um I was like, I didn't know what to do after swimming was over. I'm like, I I need to do something that'll keep me like disciplined uh or training for something because I I love to train. And you know, I went there, talked to the coach, uh Joe Petruski, and um he was like, Yeah, come on by, check out what we got. And he saw some sort of potential. And I ended up, long story short, I ended up training with the regional team there. I was alternate for the 2016 regional team in the mid-Atlantic. Nice. Um, only reason I wasn't on it was because I couldn't snatch 225, but now that's not an issue. Yeah, um, but yeah, that's you know, I just wanted to be part of something that was very competitive outside of the sport of swimming. And you know, CrossFit Love had that community and it was very competitive, so it was a good fit. And that from there on it was a wrap.

SPEAKER_02 6:14

Yeah. So I've been doing this a long time. Like as you start to hear your stars tour, you can almost kind of put people into like tiers or sections. It's like that's a really common thread for someone, the former college athlete, accomplished athlete. It's not just you wanting to compete, it's the lifestyle, it's the pursuit of something, it's training. You said the discipline. So, what does that make you? Are you are you in your 30s yet?

SPEAKER_00 6:36

Yeah, yeah, in the 33. I 33.

SPEAKER_02 6:38

So you got you got your first year of masters coming up in a couple years, right? Yeah, I'm excited. That could open the door. So are you still competing yourself right now? I know you're coaching, um, you work at a gym. Um, the are you still pursuing any competitive endeavors, or is it, hey, I compete all the time just because that's why I am wired. But are there competitive goals um within yourself?

SPEAKER_00 6:58

Yeah, I mean, I would love to make semifinals. I would obviously love to make the games at some point in my career, whether that's masters or individual. Cool. Uh I do think I had the potential to do it. It's, you know, not making excuses, but you know how it goes owning a gym and running a competition, doing other things. It's it's tough. So, you know, hopefully this year I can prioritize training a little bit more and make like one solid run at it.

SPEAKER_03 7:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:24

Uh and then, you know, if it works out great, if not, then I'm just gonna keep keep rocking with my community. We have pretty tough workouts. I have senior workouts, we we program quite similarly. So uh, you know, I think that if I compete, it's very selective on where I compete. Um, I don't want to just do random competitions just to do them. You know, injuries can happen anywhere, so I want to be very careful about that. Yeah, the last one I did was MetCon Rush, and then before that, I did Battle at the Bay. Those were two very, very fun events. Um, they all ran really on time, top-notch events. Uh, Frank and Tim are two of my good friends, so it was cool to support them in that uh respect as well.

SPEAKER_02 8:07

Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah, I agree. I mean, you sound like a master's athlete, a seasoned, experienced masters athlete where you had to you kind of have to pick and choose your spots, right? You can't sign up for everything all the time. And it's funny, I just had, you know, Mike Warren was my partner and had a few conversations with him during and after, you know, some of those are private, but the the one thing that I would say to him, that would say to anyone that does have any sort of lofty goal, whether it's games, semis, it doesn't matter what, you know, the term lofty goal is subjective. It if you have a goal that seems hard to reach, it is it is true that when you have a lot of things going on in your life, work-wise, it's tough to make training, training the priority where really it doesn't pay the bills. It's more of a selfish endeavor at the end of the day. But you can, there are ways to pursue both. And some of that is just picking and choosing when to really pursue it, whether it's a part of the year or you know, a two-year stretch where you push some other things to the side. And you know, getting to the game's level, like it sometimes, yeah, it does become a full-time job for X amount of months while it's a heavy part-time job for the rest of the year. But you'd be surprised, especially as you approach masters, it doesn't always need to be a one-year pursuit. You can really go all in for a year, and whether you make it or not, there's still progress made that will help you in the future. Sometimes it comes down to the program. You know that. I mean, programming can really help or uh make or break certain athletes that are on the bubble.

SPEAKER_00 9:33

Yep, exactly. Um, you know, I I tell a lot to the gym athletes, just to like the regular members, and also the competitive athletes I program on the side uh for like competition and stuff. You know, they want to do the classes and they want to do uh all this extra stuff and they want to get handstand push-ups and all this. I'm like, dude, you're you're gonna burn out. And it's not I don't want to be rude, I don't want to be like that guy that's gonna be like, hey, you're gonna fail, but you know, you shouldn't be jam-packing everything into one session or just one training block because it's not gonna work out. And I think they all noticed that this weekend. You know, we had I had three athletes compete this weekend. Nice. Um, unfortunately, I wasn't able to be the full coach mode, but uh you know, they did pretty well for themselves, so I was happy for them.

SPEAKER_02 10:21

That's awesome. Yeah, it takes time at the end of the day. Like you can't really cut the corners, and I think that's what the sooner you get that in, it's like owning a gym or you know, some of the other career stuff you have, your swimming career, you guys, and that's why I like working with athletes, not exclusively, just people they get it. It's a 10 to 15 year process sometimes. It's not a I'm gonna try hard for these next four months. So, in regard to that, right? Your work ethics there, your drive is there, your knowledge of the sport is there, your passion for the sport is there on the coaching side and the community side, on the athlete side.

Creating The Vitruvian Games Vision

SPEAKER_02 10:52

Where did the inception of the forving games come from? Was it something you've you're in the comp scene already? Did you always know that you wanted to be on the event director side of it, or is that something that is somewhat new for you?

SPEAKER_00 11:06

Yeah, I mean, I so it's an interesting question. Um, no one's ever asked that question. That's a good one. So I've always wanted to own a gym, right? And yeah, you know, when I was at CrossFit Love, I would ask all the questions uh that I needed to because I knew that that was a goal of mine at some point in my life. I didn't know when it was gonna happen, but um I did know that at some point I wanted to lead in that respect, right? So once I started getting more and more competitive, I was like, hmm, I wonder how people run competitions. Like, this must be a lot of money, this coordination. I wonder how this all works. And I started asking questions there uh because I knew some of the guys that ran good competitions or ran just any competition, I just picked their brains. So um as I started getting more into them uh and asking more questions, eventually when I ended up opening my gym, I was thinking, well, what if I ran my own in-house comp? And then that's when everything started. Uh I realized how much work it was, and I ran like three or four just in-house ones with our members, nothing crazy.

SPEAKER_03 12:15

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 12:15

Uh, and I fine-tuned my skills there. Uh, one thing about me is that I'm not afraid of taking risks. It that's how you learn. You never really fail, you only learn. Um and you know, I think you need just like programming, I think you need to do rep after rep after after rep. Eventually, you'll get good enough that you can put something out there into the market for people to see your your process and your and your product. So after doing a few competitions in New Jersey, when I moved back, I was like, oh, um, why are there no individual competitions up here? Like there was Asbury Park Summer Games when it was like really big. Like that was sick. And um, you know, I learned a lot from the guy that runs that competition or ran that competition in 2017, 2019 around there. Um I was like, if I if he can do something like that, I can totally do something like that. I don't see why that would be out of the realm of possibility. So um, you know, I took notes, I have a notepad with all my ideas and tried to figure out how I can make a really great experience for everyone, right? And Wadaplooza is a major uh inspiration for me. I went there I forget what year, I think 2023, something like that. Um, and it was really eye-opening. Uh for me, I'm that's not a stab at them. I just I don't like being around too many people. So, you know, that that was a lot for me to take in, but uh I think they did a fantastic job moving to the to the beach, and you know, that's kind of what we did here. Like we started um I started Meadowlands classic, did that with with John, uh gentleman that owns um Heard Athletics.

SPEAKER_01 14:07

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 14:07

So I did that with him. We ended up going our separate ways, and then uh I was like, all right, let's do Vitruvian games, and we did that Vitruvian games in the Superdome in Waldwick.

SPEAKER_02 14:17

Yep, okay, it's right next to our town, okay.

SPEAKER_00 14:19

Yeah, yeah, it's close by. So you know that was that was great. The guy was very nice, but I was like, how do I level up from here? I can't do it in this venue again. It's just way too complicated logistically. It was really far from my gym, not really far, but like it was a drive, you know. Yeah, um, and then I did Adirondack Fitness Challenge, I ended up being able to uh make connections there. And uh the way that we leveled up that I think opened the doors to be able to have so many people from from the community scaled all the way up to elite was doing it at American Dream. And I was like, if I can do it here, like it's it's done. Like I can I can do many different events here, use different uh types of equipment, all that good stuff, and still be able to have an event for the scaled athlete, an event for the elite athlete, and still get the same quality test of fitness that they deserve and should be able to experience. Yeah, that's like the drive of it, right? I want people to feel like this is their CrossFit games.

SPEAKER_02 15:24

Honestly, yeah, and that's like I I you said some like key words there, like the experience for everyone. Um, you know, having that venue, the the week in itself be for that person. Like each, it's not for any single person, it's for every individual in that like they get to really go in there. And I've competed at Wadapalooza, I've competed at the French Throwdown, I've done all the local comps. I would say that's top three venue I think I've ever been to. And it's not just the floor, which is really cool. You did feel like you were in a a gladiator, uh, with all those things looking down on you. Yeah, but also I have a kid, I have a six-year-old, and I've also been a spectator at competitions with kids and family and 20 people that are waiting for hours in between events. Like there's all there's almost too much to do there for for kids in a way, and like I say that in a complimentary way that I there are no venues like that. You're never in a mall where you can go to one of 80 stores and restaurants and kids' activities and bathrooms and parking, like all these things are just top-notch. And I I really do think that's the best possible venue you could do something like that. Yeah. And uh so kudos to you for a thinking of it, finding it, finding a way to get it done. And like you said, you can level it up every single year. And um, now when you talk about the let's let's talk about that athlete experience side, and then we'll get into some of the programming stuff. And again, you want to keep some of the stuff hush hush, you keep some of the stuff hush hush, right? Uh, I think every event organizer has the right to do that, but how big of a lift of it is it for you and whatever team you have to find enough people to help out? Like, is because I know that when we've run comps in the past, we've never really had an issue with it, but it was always a fear. I'm like, well, what if people aren't available? What if people can't do the whole day? What if they're what if we don't have people that can really judge? Yeah, like like that, that's a really big lift for you. How do you go about finding those those right people? A quantity, but also quality.

SPEAKER_00 17:28

Yeah.

Recruiting Volunteers And Elite Judges

SPEAKER_00 17:29

Um I want to start with saying this is not like tooting my own horn or anything like that, but I think I'm a pretty genuine person. Um, I treat everyone the same, I treat the janitor the same as well as I treat the multi-billionaire the same. I've been around both. Um, just from what I used to do in the city, like I used to work with billionaires and design their homes. It's like the only difference is that they have more zeros behind their name. Yep, yeah. But they're still humans. So, you know, I think me always saying hi and thank you to the judges, always respecting them. I don't yell at my judges, yeah. Sometimes my temper gets a little high. I'm like, why would you give me a no rep? Like, I don't understand. They explain it. I'm like, all right, cool. And I just keep going. So I think all the different higher-level competitions that I do, even the local competitions, I treat everyone with the same respect. And you know, people see that and they end up saying, like, hey, this dude needs a judge, like, or this dude needs an equipment team. Let me go help him out at least for like a few hours.

SPEAKER_03 18:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:31

Right. Um, and that's not the main drive as to why I'm like that. Is that's the way I was raised. Okay. So, you know, hats off to my parents for that. But um it is a big fear. This year, I was I'm not gonna lie, man. This year, two weeks before the competition, I was not in a good mental space about it. Um, I was very nervous. Yeah, I was really hoping that people would show up. We did have about 60 volunteers, and I want to say like 12 to 13 ended up backing out last minute, which is fine, you know, that's expected, but it happens. Um judging is a huge, huge, huge fear because that's like a make or break of a competition. If you have like a pretty terrible judge, you know, it only takes one judge to ruin the entire experience. Absolutely. Um and I think, you know, our judging, I think this year was a million times better than last year. Not a knock on anyone that judged last year. I just think the overall organization of everything, the breaks between the events, the cycling of the judges through different heats was was really top-notch. Our head judge, Yamaris, um, and uh the woman that she brought to help her with her, uh Lisa Ricker, they were both games judges. I've seen that. Yamaris. Yeah, yeah. Yamaris, I actually used to coach in Philly um like eight years ago. So, you know, be having people like that uh back me and be on my side is is extremely helpful. Yeah. You know, they can say, hey, you know, this person's not that good at judging. We probably won't put them in in for this year, but maybe they can get experience in judging other competitions and they can get those skills next year. Yeah. That's another thing, it should be a learning experience. But um, some competitions I personally think shouldn't be a learning experience, others should be, but you know, it comes with the territory of the competition, the organizer.

SPEAKER_02 20:27

Yeah. No, that it's huge. It takes a so much teamwork. And I always tell our competitors at the gym, uh, and I'll say this when we host the comp the most important people at the competition are the judges, not the athletes. You guys are all replaceable. It's the judge. If the judges don't show up or they don't care, or they don't try as hard as they can, um, everything falls apart. It doesn't happen without judges, and they're not getting, you know, 500 bucks for the day. Sometimes you get, you know, some swag or a shirt or something, but it truly is volunteering. And I, you know, I applaud the judges this weekend. Again, I'm always watching that stuff from afar and with you know a critical mind. And they did, I thought they did awesome. There's no such thing as perfect judging at even at the highest level, but I've seen egregious before, and I thought the judging was really tight there, even to the point where uh in our last event we got no rep, I want to say 10 to 15 times, and they were they're all legit no reps. And at no point are you angry about it at all. It's yeah, I even will sometimes be thankful for it because I'd rather know that like I had my score is legit. I had a real judge, uh, I didn't get away with anything. You never want to win and cheat your way there or get a cheat victory. So I think uh hats off to the judges and how you guys organized it, um, some of the pre workout talks that you they had, going over the standards, the flow, everything was crystal clear. Um, a lot of time to ask and answer questions. So, from my athlete perspective, they did a great job and you know, really thankful that they they donated that time.

Teams Divisions And Athlete Surveys

SPEAKER_02 21:57

Um, when you talk about pre Programming, right? You have a lot of different divisions. You had teams. Can you correct me if I'm wrong? Was last year individual only?

SPEAKER_00 22:07

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 22:08

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 22:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:08

So let's let's start there because when you add a whole different uh side of the competition team, no, to the point, I was explaining this to some people that are somewhat new to the scene in the sport, that changes everything. No, and it it to me, in my opinion, it's actually kind of easy to individually program a comp. But you add a team to it, equipment, spacing, reps, where people stand when they're not working. I mean, everything needs to be talked about. Um, what went behind that decision? Why did you make the change? By the way, I think it was an awesome decision by you, but what made you change from indie only to indie end team?

SPEAKER_00 22:51

So uh the big decision was last year. I always send athlete surveys. You'll be getting one soon. I just haven't gotten to it yet. Uh, but uh yeah, I always send athlete surveys. Uh, I think that feedback from the athletes, and then they're all anonymous, so I get actual real answers is extremely important. That's the only reason why we were able to level up the way we leveled up this year. Um I think that uh not I think I know that we got a lot of requests for uh team competition. So I was like, you know what? Why not? Let's do it. I mean, I one of my biggest things that I did not want to happen this year was make the individuals be there for like 12 hours. That is not fun. I've been there before, it's a terrible experience. I don't, it's a waste, not a waste, but like it's a long time, man. Like you've competed and you're just exhausted by the end of the day. So I was like, all right, how can I make a really great team competition, but also make an individual competition and do that within the same day. So we decided that it would be best to just have teams in the morning because that way it'll flow. Athletes, individuals can watch their friends compete, and then the teams can also watch their individual friends compete, and they wouldn't have to be like concerned about warming up or cooling down and missing their friends, right? So, you know, that was the biggest driver. That honestly, the hardest decision was what divisions to make for the teams because I know some people like male-female, I know some people like um teams of three, a lot of people like masters, uh the combined age, some people like just 30, you know, just different things. But I think we hit the nail on the head with the teams for this year. Next year, I do plan on bringing them back. I might have masters divisions uh and not do individual. We'll see what the athlete surveys say, but okay. Um it's definitely it was definitely a challenge, but I love challenges. That's why I do this, you know.

SPEAKER_02 24:52

Yeah, that's why you are where you are. And to echo that, um, we actually canceled the competition last fall. Uh, we just the registrations were coming through, the numbers weren't there. And I remember thinking, like, man, if we did individual, it was a partner competition, and we wanted to go mixed gender, not uh same gender. And it's funny how I personally have competed a lot. I like I always prefer individual, and it's not because I'm selfish, I just think like it's just it's you versus it's all you. Like you you have yeah, you're not counting on anyone, but no one's counting on you either. Like I've been at team comms where I blow it for my team, and it just ruins your whole mindset because you feel like you blew it for someone else, you let other people down. With that said, the team stuff is a lot more fun, it's just more fun to do it with someone else. And from my gym, we have a huge competitive scene at our gym. Some serious, some hey, we do it for fun. And I've noticed that many, many, many more people want the team side more than the individual because it's a little less pressure for them in terms of like that not all eyes are on them. If they struggle with a movement or a load or just a part of CrossFit, they can kind of dish it off to someone else and they can really excel where they where they shine in CrossFit.

Affiliates Keeping Competition Alive

SPEAKER_02 26:06

It does seem like that has taken over. Now, you've been in the so you watched Rich Ronnie fall off the rope. You've been in this for a while, right? Just kind of looking, competing, coaching. I have been too. When I started the individual comps, you'd have 120 people just on the guy's side show up. 908, CrossFit Hoboken. I can remember showing up to some of these and being like, there are like 27 fire breathers here, and like they're all trying to make regionals because back then it was 60 or 40. And I remember it just made you train so hard throughout the year, it made you change how you eat, how you sleep, how you drink. I do think I think about this and talk about this all the time. I'm still passionate about the sports scene, but I feel like it's died a little bit. And I can't tell why. Part of it to me is the new guys and girls that come into cross it that are in their 20s now, they're just not interested in the comp scene. I don't know if they're more interested in looking a certain way or they just have other hobbies. I don't know if it's social media. I'm not smart enough to make that decision. I just know it, it's not as big as it used to be. But there is a glimmer of hope in me, seeing some of our younger guys that are members, guys and girls, that it's still there. There is still demand for really cool competitions that fuel people all year in their training. But we have to have events like this. We need to have people like you being supported from affiliates, maybe even from CrossFit, um, to really kind of move this thing forward. So, right now, you're gonna send out this athlete survey, you get all that feedback, you apply it to what you're gonna try to do next year. But what do you think? And and be open about this. What can affiliates, what can me, what can I do for you, what can other affiliate owners do for you to make sure that event has potential? Because everyone that has asked me about your event, I said that thing has as much potential as any event in the country, and I mean that. That means a lot, thank you. What can affiliate owners do for you to help you get to the next level?

SPEAKER_00 28:15

Um, I think it's uh being honest with their athletes. I think some and and looking at the workouts, I I'm not gonna point out what division or who it was, but there was an issue with um some of the standards, and I I mean the workouts have been posted for months. Yeah, had a question you could have just asked me. Like yeah, and there's no read there. I got a few emails from the people in that division asking me about the movement standard for that event, and I answered them, and they they get they made one one of the athletes cry in the teams. I was like, Yeah, what are you doing? Yeah, it's just not as much as I want this to be like a games like event, we are not at the games. You are ruining the experience for everyone, just to be nice about it, right?

SPEAKER_03 29:06

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:06

Um, so I think if the owners can one, obviously promote it, that'd be great. And many thanks to anyone that is promoting it, like yourself. I really appreciate it. Uh and then just reading through the workouts and say, hey, you know, Becky, I think this would be a good division for you, but this is what we need to do in order for you to really excel at this and you know, not be absolutely crushed at the end of the weekend.

SPEAKER_03 29:31

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 29:32

Or, you know, I guess some people say the volume was way too much. Okay, well, maybe that's the wrong division for you.

SPEAKER_03 29:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:38

Or uh, you know, some people said, which I I kind of understand this part, but they were like for the individual side, they're like, hey, there's a lot of cleans. Like, okay, yeah. I I looked back on it, yeah, there were decent amount of cleans. That was a mistake on my end. Um, but there was reasoning for those cleans being there. It's not that I just really obsess over cleans, I would much prefer snatches.

SPEAKER_03 29:58

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 29:59

But uh, you know, there was a reason for everything. Um, and I think the programming went really well. Uh, but affiliate owners, I think, just need to review everything and hopefully just say, like, based on the experience that everyone had, this is more of a celebration of fitness and a test of fitness rather than you know, I'm gonna go do this competition and hope for the best. Yeah, it's something to train for. That's why that's what I want to do. Yeah, I want some people to be like, all right, the open is here, the trivial games is here. Let's train for something on two opposite sides of of the year.

SPEAKER_02 30:35

Yeah, no, I love that. And like, I think that's I mean, from an affiliate owner side, our business, our classes, our vibe is better when you have a gym full of people, not everyone, but when I say full, like a lot of people training for something. That's why I'm not anti-Hy Rocks. I'm not, we're huge into the open and semis and quarters, but again, that doesn't fit for everyone. So, some people that hate the sport and snatching and muscle ups, high rocks has been a great thing for them because they feel safe in doing it. So lean into it. Let's create an environment because you know, when there's a gym full of people really pursuing hard work and results and have something that's making them a little nervous, it makes everyone want to do it as well. Like adult, adult FOMO is absolutely a real thing. And one thing I want to just say on your behalf, and I'm saying this to myself, is that the affiliate owners, maybe after the open, and once you start posting some more stuff about your dates and the workouts, try to get out there in front of your members and try to get people to literally sign up for it, not to put money in your pocket, but to make the event better. Because I know at some point, you know, I've I've talked to a couple guys that have run huge events that cost a quarter million dollars, half a million dollars, that at some point if it doesn't make money or it's just it's gonna disappear. And if something like this, which is good for the community, disappears, the whole community suffers. Yeah, by the way. And I'm not telling the owners they have to go show up for three days straight, two days straight. I'm not telling them they need to sign up and do the comps, but get if you can just if every affiliate owner got three to five people from their affiliate to do it, and then next year that's seven, next year it's 10, you're gonna have a you're gonna you're gonna be sold out, you're gonna have a wait list. And now you get to do even more things with equipment and workout. So that's where like the the further I get into this, the affiliate owners and coaches have such a responsibility to lift the big events up, even if they're not personally gonna do them. Uh, because that's how gyms work too, by the way. You know, like I'm not a marketing expert at all. I don't really know that much about it, but we've grown because other people have helped us out, they've gotten their friends, their family, and that that's where that's where the humble the humility of an owner, an event director like yourself, that's you need the help of other people to really get the event to where it can be. Um, when you look at programming and what you want to test, by the way, I don't think there are too many cleans. I I thought the programming was a home run. Um, and that's oh, you're never, you know, this, you're never gonna make everyone happy with programming. So don't even bother trying. I think the question you ask yourself, and you can, we're not gonna break down every workout. We don't have the time. Maybe we'll do that another time. But it's a balanced test of fitness. You have strength, you have gymnastics, you have a little bit of endurance, you have big volume, you have low volume, you have quick transitions, you have um different loads, and that is what this fitness is supposed to be. It's never supposed to be tailored towards a certain kind of athlete. Like maybe next year it's really heavy, maybe, or maybe next year you have a long endurance event. We should be prepared for anything. That's what CrossFit

Building A Balanced Fitness Test

SPEAKER_02 33:41

is. Now, when you are mapping out programming for all these divisions, individual and team, do you have a few kind of baseline goals of what you want the test to be? And where does that inspiration come from?

SPEAKER_00 33:57

I'm so happy you asked that. So uh I actually do I have like a huge checklist of every movement in CrossFit um that we do. And then I have another list of movements that are not like reinventing the wheel, but things that aren't very common in the space, uh, that are events are uh sorry, movements that I do at the gym that I program for the athletes, right? So I make sure that there's different loads. Like if there's a lot of cleans, for example, like this year, there were different loads. So to me, I did not think that there was an overwhelming amount of cleans. There was heavy grace, that's completely different than cleans in uh the first event.

SPEAKER_02 34:42

It's not even close. It's like that's like calling a dumbbell snatch and a deadlift, like too much pulling off the ground. Like it's don't even let that get to you. That that that's they're not the same at all.

SPEAKER_00 34:51

Yeah, yeah. So I mean, yeah, anyway. So I think that when I when I make that list, I look through, I'm like, all right, what do I want to test this year? Last year and the year before I did this, this, this, and this. This year I want to do this. I already know how many events I want to have for 2027. Okay, I already know it's gonna be extremely different. I I don't think it has been done in this area or really in any competition outside of really um the games, but um one compliment that I did get was about how there was a very sprinty type event and a very long type event. And that's what we're gonna see more of next year. Huge, love that that's an overall test of fitness. You can sprint, you can move a heavy barbell, you can do a long endurance event. If you win, then you're the most well-rounded. That's the whole point.

SPEAKER_03 35:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 35:43

Um, inspiration comes a lot from J.R. Howell. I absolutely love his programming. Very good. I think he like he, I don't know how he does it, but he's he hits home runs every single time. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 35:56

Um why I think it is, yeah. And you're in this section. I think this is why you connect with it. You compete. He's been a games athlete on the master side. You coach athletes that compete, you're involved with the community, and that's what makes it special. You are a coach, you are a competitor, you are on the community side, you are on the sports side, you understand the spectacle of watching it and what makes it fun to watch. And some people have two or three of those, they don't have all four, they don't have all four. You do, and I think that's where it's at. So keep going.

SPEAKER_00 36:29

Yeah. Um, and just to keep it short, I know you're short on time, but uh good. We got about five, ten minutes. Yeah, so you know, when I'm looking at the programming next year, I say, All right, what is that one event that's gonna be like, whoa, I've never seen that before, or this is gonna be really cool to watch. Like, I thought that Heavy Grace was gonna be the really fun event to watch, which which it was. Um, but I thought that the bike one was the coolest one to watch, you know, because that's like so high risk reward ratio. Like you can send it on the bike and you can be absolutely destroyed on the cleans. I was get a lot of heat on that because people were like, Oh, well, how are you gonna do all the cleans unbroken? I'm like, Well, mayhem did Gwen. Yeah, figured out, yeah, figured out just you gotta plan it out, you gotta train for it. Yeah, so I think you know, going into next into this coming year, uh me and um the testing team, we are already bouncing off ideas. We were rolling some of the plates and we're like, dude, what about a snail? And I'm like, ah, I don't know about that. But you know, we're I'm not afraid to do different things as long as the judging is is clear and we can make the standards very easy to communicate. That's you know, it takes a lot of team effort. Yeah, like I've I've had I think I programmed for this competition, I think I programmed over 40 workouts. Oh wow, and a lot of them were shut down because the judging was too obscure, or you know, it just wouldn't work with the setup. It would take too long to set up. And you know, I gotta work with like five different people in order for these events to really happen the way that they should be, so that the equipment team can get in and out, and the athletes would have a good experience on the floor and it wouldn't be delayed. You know, it's and it all comes down to timing, and you know that like huge schedule's huge.

SPEAKER_02 38:15

Yeah, you guys are. I mean, you're ahead of schedule, and that that's a big deal. Yeah, and once you change one thing, you have to change other. And then if you change that, you change that. Like it's it's amazing what the domino effect is when you even just change one element of a workout, equipment, movement, load, and but again, that's why that sometimes the best time to think about it is right after you do the like your mind is spinning because you're probably self-criticizing the entire weekend. Oh, what if we did this? What if we made this percent order? And but that's that's what humility is, that's what growth is, that's why you do surveys.

Logistics Aesthetics And Floor Choices

SPEAKER_02 38:47

Um, and again, it's it's never about making the event perfect, it's trying to make the event better than last year, right?

SPEAKER_00 38:54

At the end of the day, it's also aesthetics, you know, like right. That's that's a huge thing. We've got into me and my team have gotten into many arguments about uh certain things, like the pylons. They're like, dude, why do we need pylons? I'm like, bro, it looks like we need pylons because the spectators need to know where the people are at. If I'm a spectator, how am I gonna know that Dave is on rep number 29? Yep. Besides like the hand signals, you know, like and then some judges sometimes forget about the hand signals because again, these are volunteers, but I think that having an aesthetically pleasing floor that everyone knows what's happening, even people that don't know anything about CrossFit, especially at the mall, yeah, goes a super long way. And I learned that from Dave Castro's book. Like, yep, saying it's you know, it's it's incredible what you can do with a beautiful floor.

SPEAKER_02 39:42

Yeah, oh the floor is awesome. Do you uh is is that that's a hockey rink, right? Did is that your turf that you put on it, or is it the theirs? No, thank God. That's theirs, yeah. That's theirs. Okay, and then have you ever considered I thought the surface was great. I actually like gave you another check mark when I'm like, wow, they got the you guys brought out the rubber lifting mat for the barbell and the jump rope. Yeah, because like I've done jump rope on turf before, you can make it work, no excuses, but it's not, it's not uh, it's not great. And the fact that you brought them out just goes to show, like again, you you get it, right? Um, is that your ideal floor big term? Have you ever thought about getting the one like the rubber floor for the entire thing? Again, a whole different level of cost and setup. Um, I thought the gym, the floor looked great. I don't mind handstand walking on it. I think you can light lift on it without a problem. Um is the floor, is that gonna be the way it is, you think, long term, or have you had any thoughts about that in the future?

SPEAKER_00 40:38

I would like to do I would like to do rubber flooring. Um we did have that option. Uh the only thing is that it it's cost, man. Like it's so much money. And I don't think I don't think athletes really understand how much money it takes to run an event like this. Yep, and uh they don't and you know it's part of the game, but it it costs a significant amount of money to get that much flooring into and and manpower. Just forget, like these all the people that volunteered are my members. I mean, we've had we had like maybe 10, 15 people that are not part of our community, but it's manpower and cost. So if we can make it work, I would love to have a rubber floor next year. Um, if not, we'll probably maintain the the black turf. I think it worked out really great this year.

SPEAKER_02 41:27

It worked out awesome. So yeah, I'm not asking for that, by the way. I was just curious because again, that's like the stuff I look at. I think it looks great, and you can lift on that. You it's not that you can't lift on that. So it's um, and again, it's not that it's like grass where it's like uneven and there's holes and divots, like it's a little soft, but you can you can still lift on that for sure.

Mall Exposure Motivation And Why

SPEAKER_02 41:45

Um last thing, um, I actually have like a couple of contacts with CrossFit. I'm gonna like send them this event and talk to them about it because being in the mall, I I don't, I'm just gonna make this number out of thin air. I tried to come up with like a way to figure it out, but I have to think there's probably 5,000 people that walk by that competition over the course of the weekend, might even be more that just stop for a minute, for two minutes, for 10 minutes, and like some of them are laughing because we look absolutely ridiculous, like sprinting on a bike. Yeah, um, but it's hard not to be like, what is this? Especially if you have people that are into fitness, especially with the high rocks craze, fitness racing, right? You and I know cross-it sport, how big it is, and how cool it is, and we love it. But a lot of people are like, and what is nice, not everyone out there is a mutant, you know, not everyone out there is built like a Greek god, like there's very normal looking people doing these things, and that is what people walking around a mall with an ice cream in their hand want to see. It's like they so ironic. Yeah, they're normal people, yeah. Um, that like how much does that inspire you to keep going? That this is a marketing tool for your gym, which what's the name of your gym again? CrossFit K E. CrossFit K E in in Lynnhurst, yeah. All right, so anyone that near that area, go check them out, drop in. Maybe I'll try to come drop in in some time too. But the the um the opportunity this has marked because everyone, I know all these affiliate owners are constantly complaining about not having commercials or enough support from CrossFit, which I've always been down on. It's not their job to get the people in the building, it's your job, and you have to keep them there. Yeah, um, but this event can do that. I'm telling you, I'm I would promise, I would swear my heart, there's gonna be people that look into CrossFit because of that competition. It's like impossible to not. And how much does that inspire you to wrap this up? How much does that inspire you to keep this thing going, level up?

SPEAKER_00 43:44

Uh it it's really the only reason why, man. Like, I again, I was in a very um not good mental space two weeks before this comp just because of the year that I had was very hard personally, and also last year uh there was a lot of things that went wrong last year, and it means a lot that so many people came out from last year to come support this year and had faith in us to fix everything, and I think we really did that uh in a very big way. But um, you know, all of the positive feedback that I got from this year, all of the inspiration that people said that they got from this competition is it means the world. Like that's why I do this. I don't do it for the money, I don't do it because I like to be on social media. I actually don't like being on social media. I have to because of the gym.

SPEAKER_01 44:30

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 44:30

But um, you know, I did I open an affiliate to change people's lives, and I'm doing this competition to give people something to train to train for in order to change their lives as well. So, like, if I can do that and make a thousand dollars, make five dollars, great. Yeah, but uh, you know, it's really it's really cool and it's really fulfilling knowing that we hit the nail on the head with this competition and that people are inspired to continue competing or even just get into competitions in general. It doesn't have to be mine, it could be could be your competition, it could be my friend Lauren down at Arcs. Uh could be any any gym owner, any competition. Like just get out there and challenge yourself, do hard things, right? Yeah, that's what it's all about.

Final Support And Closing

SPEAKER_02 45:16

Yeah. All right, Andrew, thank you so much, my man. Um, you have my word, you know, you'll have you'll have bison support as much as we can. We'll try to get people to sign up for next year. Um, stay in touch throughout the year. Um, I mean it because I do think one of the worst things you could do is not ask for help and support, you know, and and owners, coaches, if you're watching and listening, athletes, um, this is the kind of stuff that moves the needle forward. It's not a marketing campaign handed down from CrossFit that you put on your Instagram. It's it's connecting people, giving people a reason to train and showing what they can do via competing in sport. And at the end of the day, that's what a lot of people want. What am I capable of? What can my body do? What can make me motivated? And these are the kind of events Andrew's the kind of guy that that moves the needle forward in this space. And I think it helps a lot of us out, even if you're business only. This thing can help out your business. And uh, we really look forward to talking down the road. And don't be a stranger. I'll definitely come and drop in and we'll see if we can help you out next year. All right. Thank you, man. Likewise. All right, thanks, Andrew. Thanks so much. Thank you, everybody, for taking the time out of your day to listen to the Herd Fit podcast. Be on the lookout for next week's episode.