S05E196 Finding Strength Beyond Injury: CrossFitter Dan Greenberg Tackling His First Hyrox Competition
Ever wonder what it's like to tackle one of fitness's fastest-growing challenges alone? In this revealing conversation, CrossFit Bison member Dan Greenberg @danmg1128 takes host coach David Syvertsen @davesy85 through his journey of completing the Hyrox race as a solo competitor. What makes this story particularly remarkable is Dan's comeback from a potentially career-ending back injury that required surgery just a few years prior.
Dan shares how he went from being told he had "the worst squat ever seen" to becoming one of the strongest pound-for-pound athletes at his gym. His spontaneous decision to register for Hyrox came without specific training beyond his regular CrossFit routine, yet he completed the challenge with impressive consistency. Maintaining an eight-minute mile pace across eight 1000-meter runs while tackling stations including ski erg, sled push/pull, rowing, and wall balls, Dan discovered that the running portions were surprisingly easier than the strength elements for many participants.
The conversation explores the fascinating logistics of Hyrox, which has grown from 700 participants in London to over 40,000 registrants worldwide in just a few years. Unlike traditional CrossFit competitions that can span entire days with significant downtime, Hyrox offers an efficient, streamlined experience with excellent spectator engagement. Dan and host David Syvertsen debate whether the event will maintain its explosive growth trajectory or follow other fitness trends that have plateaued after initial enthusiasm.
Perhaps most valuable are Dan's insights about training for such events. While many assume running capacity is the primary determinant of success, Dan highlights the often-overlooked importance of strength training. The stronger you are, the less each station depletes your energy reserves for the runs. His experience proves that CrossFit provides an excellent foundation for High Rocks, though specific training for certain elements like the sled pull can make a significant difference in performance.
Ready to push your fitness boundaries in a new way? Dan's story might just be the motivation you need to take on your first Hyrox challenge.
#Hyrox #HyroxTraining #HyroxWorld #HyroxAthlete #HyroxCompetition #HyroxLife #HyroxWorkout #HyroxCommunity #HyroxPrep #HyroxJourney
@crossfitbison @crossfittraining @crossfit @crossfitgames #crossfit #sports #exercise #health #movement #crossfitcoach #agoq #clean #fitness #ItAllStartsHere #CrossFitOpen #CrossFit #CrossFitCommunity @CrossFitAffiliates #supportyourlocalbox #crossfitaffiliate #personalizedfitness
S05E196 Finding Strength Beyond Injury: CrossFitter Dan Greenberg Tackling His First Hyrox Competition
TRANSCRIPT
David SyvertsenHost
00:05
Hey everybody, welcome to the Herd Fit Podcast with Dr Sam Rhee and myself, coach David Syverson. This podcast is aimed at helping anyone and everyone looking to enhance their healthy lifestyle through fitness, nutrition and, most importantly, mindset. All right, welcome back to the Herd Fit Podcast. I am Coach David Syrson. I'm here with Dan Greenberg, a longtime CrossFit Bison member, who just took on his first ever High Rocks race and, unlike last week when we had Ashley and Karen on, dan did this by himself and I think it's a completely different experience doing it solo versus doing it with partners. I'm not going to say easier or harder, although it is more work to do individual. I do want to talk about the difference in experience. But, dan G, how are you, my man?
Dan GreenbergGuest
00:52
I'm good.
David SyvertsenHost
00:53
Thanks for having me.
Dan GreenbergGuest
00:54
I'm excited to be here.
David SyvertsenHost
00:55
It's awesome. Dan is a very experienced CrossFitter. He's also pound for pound, one of the strongest dudes I know, especially with the squad just a very and he has a brazen background. We had christy on a few weeks ago and we all know how much they lift weights and dan's one of their. You know their early members. Were you only with them back in hoboken?
Dan GreenbergGuest
01:14
yeah, I started when I was uh 29, was in decent shape, I felt like, but you know, wanted to be in better shape my 30s and I wasn't my 20s. So uh, big Jay told me I had the worst squat he's ever seen, knees caving in. Wasn't squatting my body weight initially, but, yeah, I found it fell in love quickly, got really strong really quick. It was fun.
David SyvertsenHost
01:36
You did. I mean, there's probably something in you genetically because you are just you are. What kind of what most people want is you're actually stronger than you look right, you don't come in all of a sudden, dan. You turn around, dan, squatting 400 pounds. You're like wow at that body weight, it's really rare to do.
01:52
And when you're light and strong, with a barbell in CrossFit you can do a lot of things at a high level because Dan's a great runner Obviously High Rocks. He's a great gymnast the muscle-ups, the handstand pushups. He can get through a lot of workouts because he has a very good aerobic system. But you put a barbell on his back, like a lot of the people that are good at gymnastics and running, they can't squat 400 pounds the way Dan did. So but, dan, before we get into your experience, I actually want to talk about something that's just equally as inspiring to me, and to many others as well, is you suffered a pretty gruesome back injury a few years ago and to me, from my perspective, it looks like you're back full bore. Do you feel that way?
Dan GreenbergGuest
02:34
I probably don't max out where I used to and I try not to lift with as much ego as I used to. Okay, but it's being able to turn your animal uh you know, your animal brain off when, uh, you're not feeling a hundred percent. So I was lifting like a, like a jerk um, instead of like taking two weeks off and letting it, uh, letting heal. I turned probably a bulging disc and pounded in into a herniated disc. So it took about a year from the time I injured, uh, epidural surgery, recovery before I was back.
David SyvertsenHost
03:08
So you went full ball surgery on it.
Dan GreenbergGuest
03:10
Yeah, I mean in retrospect. I felt better the same day. I would have done it sooner. But you've got to do all the conservative measures of like epidurals therapy before you even get to the point where you can do surgery. But I don't recommend like blowing your back out if you do and you have thoughts around surgery. I was a big, big fan of that. I'm glad I did it.
David SyvertsenHost
03:30
Awesome and I think you're just a pretty disciplined person in general and I think people that have good discipline. That applies to outside the gym. You can recover and I think that's a big part of any time people get injured, especially in a serious manner. When you go under the knife like that, it is very possible to get back to where you want to be 80%, 90% and just make responsible decisions from there on out. But that recovery process takes a lot of discipline, doing a lot of things you don't want to do, monotonous things, and not trying to skip steps just so that you can get back into the gym. That's something I always really respect about you and both and Matt Aquino. Both you guys have had back surgeries and I had you guys in the same class doing one of the open workouts this year and I just remember watching the two of you just crushed workouts and I'm like wow, like this is an example that I think we really need to get out there. So maybe for another time we'll see how you do today in today's podcast.
Dan GreenbergGuest
04:21
Well, you're goosing me up pretty good.
David SyvertsenHost
04:26
I'd love to come back, yeah, uh. So let's talk about high rocks. Because, dan, when did you sign up for this? And and why? You know why? Why did you want to take this on?
Dan GreenbergGuest
04:33
I think I saw you. You did it down in texas in dallas with you, with your brother. Uh, talk to you afterwards. You were a fan of that, would do it again. Uh, obviously, alondra is like the fittest person I think I've ever met, seriously so accomplished. You know, big, big runner, I feel like I'm a okay runner.
David SyvertsenHost
04:50
Very good runner. I'll say it Very good runner.
Dan GreenbergGuest
04:52
And I think she posted on the Facebook group that it was coming to New York. Sign up quickly, it sells out quickly. So I was like, oh, whatever, I'll just do it.
David SyvertsenHost
05:02
So spontaneous, like quickly. So I was like, oh, whatever, I'll just do it. So spontaneous is like, hey, I'm going to do it. That's awesome. Now, did you train specifically for it? Was it something that you were hey, I'm going to train and show up day of because you are fit and capable of doing that. Or is it hey, I want to have something in my scope to train for a little bit of fuel to the fire.
Dan GreenbergGuest
05:18
I. I was pretty confident that everything that we do at bison would position me for the inside stuff, so like we row all the time like lunges weren't going to be a problem yeah, because they're not fun, you get through them.
05:29
Wall balls are a good movement for me, yep, um, so a little bit of like the training on the sled pull and push. Uh, that actually was. The sled pull was the hardest movement. I thought, okay, I might have done an extra round there. Uh, it was definitely my worst, worst time to uh inside movement. Um, check the tape on that one. Um, but I'm not a great distance runner. That was actually interesting. With the back injury Um story, is that the one thing I could do for a couple of months? You're not supposed to lift anything heavier than a jug of milk, which was tough with a toddler and a second one on the way. Um, but I did a lot of, lot of running, um, and that was an okay recovery. So I got into it a little bit like that, but had never run, you know, the equivalent of five miles in a single shot.
David SyvertsenHost
06:12
That actually turned out to be the easier part of the race, agreed, yeah, yeah it's funny how, when you look at the total sum of running, it's a lot, yeah, for what we do. And I'm not sure if you're a guy that goes for, like, a sunday run, five, six, seven, eight miles, but breaking it up into thousand meter runs where it's kind of you're almost programmed to do that, like crossfitters are very good at doing a lot of different things back to back to back, where a marathon runner might really struggle to go into a mixed modal presence like that. Um, when it comes to the running, you said it was easier, right? I'm looking at your split times pretty consistent 457, 454, 507, 513, 528, 529, 532. And then the last one shouldn't really count 715, because it had the extra 200 meters in it. So you were right around five minutes to 520 for almost the entire thing, which means you were pretty well paced throughout.
Dan GreenbergGuest
07:05
Yeah for to 520 for for almost the entire thing, which means you were pretty well paced throughout. Yeah, for the uh, for the non-meter people, it was uh roughly like an eight minute mile pace okay, okay, good it was.
David SyvertsenHost
07:11
I wouldn't be able to do that math real quick, so that's a solid. If you were to go back and do it again, um well, let me ask you this first did you go into it with more, less experience? Let's do the experience, let's get a good day of working out in, or was it? Hey, I'm going to try to. I had a. I have a competitive goal here.
Dan GreenbergGuest
07:28
It was just I'm going to do it, um, and you get getting back to the training for a second. Like the time was actually really ideal, was Murph?
David SyvertsenHost
07:36
Um right, A week before you're actually, it's a good point.
Dan GreenbergGuest
07:38
And I'm like you know, if I train for Murph like I normally do, you know weighted vest arm partition. Like what is Murph, it's running, pulling, pushing, squatting, running.
David SyvertsenHost
07:48
What's high?
Dan GreenbergGuest
07:49
rocks Running, pushing, pulling, squatting running, more Movement patterns.
David SyvertsenHost
07:53
That's a great point. Yeah, I mean I knew that the whole the body weight slash running was good training for the people that were doing it. It was more coincidental. I don't think high rocks does that with any sort of murph mindset in them, but you did see some people that were nervous to do murph the week of high rocks. Did you do it on the on the week of?
Dan GreenbergGuest
08:15
I did, yeah, the uh. I did it on partition. I was still feeling the uh, the lots a little bit.
David SyvertsenHost
08:20
Okay, kind of hurt me, I think, on the ski and the and maybe the sled pole yeah okay, so would, if you were to go back and do it again, would you not do murph, or would you do it? Maybe some people do murph like, uh, the weekend before, like two, three days before, or is that again, dave, I don't really care, because I was doing it for the experience yeah, I don't really care, I'd do it the same way so will you do this again and we'll talk about where you're at future-wise?
08:42
but you did it individual. Were you glad you did it individual? Because most of the people from Bison did it with a team and I've competed individually and as a team before. I always say team is more fun, individual is more like hey, this is a challenge, I got to do this by myself. Did you even consider going for a partner? You're like no, I want to do this by myself first.
Dan GreenbergGuest
09:01
Yeah, I do this by myself first. Yeah, I mean I'm kind of introverted anyway and I was cool doing it by myself and um, like logistic stuff it's hard with kids and families and to get everybody on the same page. I was like I'll do it, I'll do it at my own pace, It'll be good.
David SyvertsenHost
09:14
Would you have trained differently if you got to go back and do it again and again? I know we're going to keep circling back to Dave. I'm just doing this for experience. I'm fit enough to do it. Is there anything you wish you did a little bit more of?
Dan GreenbergGuest
09:26
Probably the stuff I don't do quite as much. The sled pole, yeah, so I was like pulling it. I wasn't using my legs as much. I think some of the other people that had said yeah there's probably a technique to the burpee broad jumps that I wasn't doing. I was probably I did a few extra than because I wasn't jumping very far.
David SyvertsenHost
09:44
Right.
Dan GreenbergGuest
09:45
And there's a sort of a ramp up in cycle to it. I don't know if you felt like this in the doubles, but the ski was first the push. Those two felt reasonably easy.
David SyvertsenHost
09:57
Complementary to the run.
Dan GreenbergGuest
09:58
Yeah, the sled pull, the burpees and the row were probably the most challenging part, right in the middle, the burpees and the row were probably the most challenging part, right in the middle, and then I felt the farmer carry the lunges and the wall balls were my favorite thing.
David SyvertsenHost
10:10
Yeah, it definitely compounds and I want to say I'm logistically very impressed with the operation there, but also I think the programming is set up correctly in terms of the order. It's a little bit of a gauntlet towards the end.
Dan GreenbergGuest
10:28
It keeps people in the game for the first four to five stations I felt like I was able to catch up towards the end.
David SyvertsenHost
10:31
Like you know, these little pods, yeah, like 20 people at a time, yeah, and you're I mean, you're very lower body like that is your strength and you're a good runner, and I also think anyone can get through the first half hour right and then then it goes to show it, to show it's like all right. Where where are the differences here? Did you start to cramp up at all? Did you start to look into your workouts your sorry, not your workouts more like your nutrition and hydration leading up to? I'm like, oh shoot, I should have done this.
Dan GreenbergGuest
10:58
It's interesting. I much you use like AI or chat, gpt or any, not as much as I should. So here, like I've been using it work, it helps a lot with like writing emails and that kind of stuff.
11:08
So I said, hey, I'm doing high rocks, this is what I'm thinking about, here's when I start, here's when I'm going to wake up. Here's what I'm thinking about in terms of carbs, fat and protein hydration, Like is this a good plan? Are there any tweaks that you would make? And it was like I put in the stuff that I'm using and it's like this is a good plan. You want to make sure that you're having, like you know, I like took a honey packet right before I started in terms of quick carbs.
11:32
That's huge, I probably would have had a gel pack or something.
David SyvertsenHost
11:35
Yeah, you said that to me a couple of days ago, right? Yeah, to take like halfway through thoughts on that, because I think that's important for people to know.
Dan GreenbergGuest
11:42
So they do a great job. You can't bring your own, like water, um, in. They have water and I think they have, like the high rocks, you know, branded hydration stuff, um, but I I would have needed like a quick carb, like I don't know you're not running around with a banana in your pocket but like some sort of like gummy or like gel or quick carb like halfway through. I think would have helped.
David SyvertsenHost
12:02
Yeah, those are big. Now I see these like triathletes kind of pull something out of their sports bra or their shorts and this is a quick like, just basically sugar that you can just put. Did you start to feel like you were running out of fuel or were you cramping up at all?
Dan GreenbergGuest
12:14
It's funny I cramp up on a, so if I do Murph with a vest on partition like my, like the squats are where it gets me.
David SyvertsenHost
12:21
Quads, quads.
Dan GreenbergGuest
12:22
Okay, and same thing happened on the lunges, so like if I would straight my legs, both like legs would lock up. So I had to like Terrible fear. I had to do like maybe like a 90%, like lockout yeah, not a full lockout.
David SyvertsenHost
12:33
Oh, that's more than most people. That's true out there, some of those lunges are complete jokes. But again, again, I mean, you're going to see, it's not a high rocks problem. I think it's a person, a people problem, because you see that in CrossFit as well. Now, did you have any time management, pain management issues? Because you're a working professional, you have a young family, you can't make training the priority for this, because, especially training for this, if you're really going to train for high rocks, you got to train for an hour to two hours often, in addition to some of your CrossFit type work. Did you struggle with that as all? Because, again, there's a lot of people in our area of life 30s, 40s, young families. Jobs. Did you stress out about that at all? Or was like hey, dude, I'm fit enough, I can just do what I can when I can.
Dan GreenbergGuest
13:20
More of the latter. I mean, we had a good Sunday morning crew. Yeah, ash organized that, it was Karen, brittany, katie, a few others, um, and that was mostly just to get the running in Yep. And so I was confident with the other stuff that I'd be able to do wall balls, lunges, like yeah we do that, don't worry. Yeah, um, so I, I feel confident about all that, uh, all that part of it, um any pain management issues in the training.
13:49
Uh, slightly funny stories. I work in New York. Um, they had an early. I did it Friday. I did an early registration in Midtown so I was like, oh, I'll walk, there's where my work shoes there, walking back and I'm like I'm starting to get blisters on the bottom of my feet. Like two days before the race I was like you, idiot. You should just like take a subway.
David SyvertsenHost
14:08
Oh, registration for the day of the race. So this is the week of oh, this is like Wednesday.
Dan GreenbergGuest
14:12
I was like, oh, I'll just walk there. There's no like direct subway, it's going to be easy. And then, like I used a chat to me, I'm like here's like some of the brands I like, this is what, like High Rocks requires. Like here's a few options Like what do you think? Okay?
David SyvertsenHost
14:32
What did it end up being for you?
Dan GreenbergGuest
14:34
It's a company called Mount the Coast.
David SyvertsenHost
14:36
Okay.
Dan GreenbergGuest
14:36
Like the running shoes, I got like wide feet and they like had a wide toe box. It was like balancing stability, running Extra cushioning.
David SyvertsenHost
14:42
Yeah, a little bit. Did that impact your ability to lunge at all squat at all? I heard a few feedback from people that did this.
Dan GreenbergGuest
14:50
Not really the only way I'm trying to think.
David SyvertsenHost
14:58
Some people said they were falling off balance left and right because some of these running shoes now it gets crazy with it. They look like the old school Spice Girl platform shoes. They're just so high off the ground because there's like two inches of foam which makes your joints feel great when you're running. But trying to balance on that can be a little tough but you don't have any issues with it.
Dan GreenbergGuest
15:14
Maybe just the broad jumps where you're landing a little funny on these like sponges, yeah right.
David SyvertsenHost
15:19
Um, how competitive did it feel for you during the race? Because, again, I know why you went to and I know why you did it. But there's an element to you pass this person. That person passed you. Were you like looking at people's screens at all, like were you trying to catch up to people? Did you have any thoughts of people passing you? Because you do start with a group of guys.
Dan GreenbergGuest
15:40
Yeah, they put you in like a pen.
David SyvertsenHost
15:41
Yeah, cool, that was really cool sizing other people up, but you know it's almost like they try to make it like a religious experience in terms of, like, close your eyes, everything. You know it was a little. I didn't love that. Um, yeah, but did. Were there any guys in there like did it get a little? Not, I'm not saying you're trying to beat people, but did it add some fuel, to add some intensity to the race overall?
Dan GreenbergGuest
16:00
yeah, I mean, I mean a little bit. So you're definitely sizing people up, yeah, and there's a few alphas that are puffing their chests out and pushing their way to the front of the line the headband.
David SyvertsenHost
16:10
Wire thing Eye blast.
Dan GreenbergGuest
16:14
But you're sort of clumped with a group of people and you're keeping an eye on the foot, just like you are here. Right, you're competitive. Again, there were some people that got a little bit ahead of me. I thought I caught up to.
David SyvertsenHost
16:24
What was cool is those first like two or three stations right, the, uh, the ski, the sled, push, sled, pull, the the slower people from the previous heats they're, they're gone by then. So when you get to the ski and you get to the sled you kind of know where you stack up within that heat. Not that it matters that much because there's so many heats within your division, but I thought that was a cool component to it, that, like when I did it with my brother, we were like the second ones to the ski and like the first ones off the sled and then it just you kind of lose track of that because of you start catching up to the previous seats. Yeah.
Dan GreenbergGuest
16:57
I mean there was a yoke guy in my group and he was ahead. I sort of caught up to him towards the end, hands on his knees for the wall balls. I was like 30 wall balls that I'm game of fistball. Like come on man, like well, you know, it's like I gotcha.
David SyvertsenHost
17:11
I knew I was going to get you the entire time. You know those are like the, the silent assassins in CrossFit workouts. A high rocks is like you can be ahead of them the whole time. They know the entire time. Like I'm gonna get you and it's, I'm just gonna put a smile and give you that pitiful uh fist pound out to you. Uh, the logistics of the event right, they put you in that pen. You know they had that countdown from, I think, all the way down from 10 minutes up until leading up to your heat. They have a hype person. Were you impressed logistically how well that was run because they had about tens of thousands of people pumping through there in three days?
Dan GreenbergGuest
17:42
yeah, I mean even just like the technology and having like the, the band around your ankle and knowing like, oh, I'm on lap two and like I go to this workout next, and like that's what I think was concerned about, is like you had to run through the in thing Every time On the third time. Yeah, look, I forget. You know I'm on 14 or 16 reps most of the time All the time. It actually was pretty easy. There was a big leaderboard, you know your ankle would, your name would be up there and it would say you know, dan Greenberg, lap two, workout six is the next one.
David SyvertsenHost
18:13
Yeah, made it easy. That's cool. The server was down during our race, so the entire race I would run by that, the name board and it said Adam and Dave. Uh, lap one. We're like 45 minutes into the thing of the first run and I'm like, oh, this thing is not registering, but it ended up being Okay. Um, any any fears going into it? Whether it be injury, whether it be just not knowing what you were doing, were there any fears that you had going in? Or, if if there was, just what was the biggest one and what ended up happening to that fear?
Dan GreenbergGuest
18:44
if there, was just what was the biggest one and what ended up happening to that fear. It's weird, I mean no fear. It's awesome it is. It's like the analogy I would use is like first time playing golf for the season Right, low expectations. It's like you actually probably play better most of the times when you go in like that. Yeah, there are things I would definitely train for more doing it again, but like look you're.
David SyvertsenHost
19:04
You're a pretty relaxed, like even-tempered dude. In general, though and I think that's a big part of signing up for a competition is like you can stay relaxed. Yeah yeah, you don't need to work with Rafi, right? Your mindset's in a good spot. What are those things Like? What would you have trained more? I mean, we talked about the sled, the push and the pull, but was there anything run-based that you would train more Like? Would you train? I asked the girls this, and there's no right or wrong answer Would you train the running more to improve your speed, or train the run more so that you can be a little bit more consistent than you were?
Dan GreenbergGuest
19:41
Yeah, I mean, I don't run that fast, I think what helps me. Going back to the earlier, like squatting, I got tight hamstrings yeah, so you kind of get the stretch reflex for for that. I think that actually hurts me. On longer distance you're not getting as long of a stride you're absolutely up in it. You're short, so yeah, it's probably. I would probably work more on like flexibility and trying to like improve my running, like because that's where you're going to make up a difference like you're running a six minute mile pace versus an eight minute mile pace.
20:05
Like you do that eight times, like do the math, like that's where you're going to make up your time and yeah, you're not going to get that much faster at the stations.
David SyvertsenHost
20:11
Yeah, you're not going to like row a minute 20 faster or anything like that like, if you, I mean, what's a good thousand meter pace around here?
Dan GreenbergGuest
20:20
is it like 150 for guys? Yeah you know, people are running like like growing 220 pace yeah, it's so it's. It's such a small component versus, you know, being able to pick up some time on on the runs yep, did you like the schedule of it and logistics of?
David SyvertsenHost
20:36
because you've you've done cross at competition before right? And one thing I don't love about the local cross at comp scene is sometimes it's like a 7 am to 5 pm commitment. You know you're just gone out 10 hours or you work out for 12 minutes, you wait for two hours. This is a really efficient and I do think that matters for working professionals that have families, like you can't. Just it's harder for you to disappear all day. Did you? Were you impressed with that side of the operation, like the check-in process where you could sit, and how quickly you were actually done?
Dan GreenbergGuest
21:06
That part was great and I think I lucked out just based. They break up the starting times based on the race you're doing, whether it's core or pro, singles, doubles, relay, men, women. And so I was 8 am on Friday. It was like I think it was a loss. It's not far off of what I would normally do from a bison. I'd work six or 7am workout.
David SyvertsenHost
21:28
And you signed up specifically for Friday right.
Dan GreenbergGuest
21:31
Signed up for Friday so I've got my wife works full time, so like what's going to be the least bothersome to the rest of my family. The Friday, like I was, I took off work. Friday was like Took a vacation day.
David SyvertsenHost
21:44
Yeah, friday was a vacation day. Yeah, um, yeah, so that that that's a big part. I always want to tell people I think this is the third time I'm talking about it on the herd fit podcast is, when you sign up for this thing, you have a. You don't have a lot of control of of heat times and stuff, Right? I mean you could sign up for a specific divisions and specific divisions, like the men's pro individual, for example. They're usually later in the day. When Ashley and Karen were going, I think their first heat was like 5.45 at night.
22:09
It's totally different. It's a totally different commitment, totally different nutrition and hydration leading up to Like you have to eat throughout the day, which I don't love doing. You got to do it like you normally do. Dan's a morning workout guy here at Bison, and being able to do it somewhat close to your hours are huge. Um, what was your favorite part of the day like? What was the one thing like? If in five months from now, you're gonna look back like, oh, that was that just made it a fun time? Was there one thing that really kind of brought you to that place?
Dan GreenbergGuest
22:40
it was probably. I mean, it was finishing yeah, right getting that last run doing that last run on the stage.
David SyvertsenHost
22:45
Yeah.
Dan GreenbergGuest
22:45
Getting the pat, you know, yeah, you felt the sense of accomplishment, finishing that, they hand you a non-alcoholic beer. So that's not what I needed. I needed something a little stronger. But and then you know, we lived in Hoboken. We went to breakfast afterwards at Hoboken. Yeah, so you can eat whatever you want.
David SyvertsenHost
23:03
Did your wife get to come in and watch Nice? That's huge. That makes it a fun. What was her feedback on watching it? Did she have fun watching it?
Dan GreenbergGuest
23:11
So I met her afterwards. She didn't go to the event.
David SyvertsenHost
23:14
So I want to start the spectator experience because I brought Brock in to watch Ash and last minute decision I didn't even get the tickets until two days before. Last minute decision I didn't even get the tickets until two days before and it was like a lot of fun to watch and it wasn't long and I think if anyone ever wants to watch, especially with kids, bringing kids anywhere is risky and I only have one. But it kind of made it interesting that, all right, they go to the station and then about five to six minutes later they're back at another station, so you have enough time to walk around. Brock and I made a game of it, saying like, all right, what station is she going to next? She got to go look for number six, go look for number seven and then you go to the track, you try to give them a high five on one of the laps and I think it's a very spectator-friendly experience. And I don't have the exact number, but the London race in 2021 was between 600 and 700 people in it on a one day race and they were done at 3 pm. Okay, so just one day, 600 people, ish, okay. This year in London three day race and they have 40,000 people signed up in a four-year run. I mean, the percentage growth of this thing is massive.
24:28
They were on CNBC the other day. I don't know if you caught that, that interview. You're a business guy, you know a finance guy. Do you do? You does your skill set. Do you ever go into like all right, this is growth, like this is what they need to do, this is what CrossFit could do? Do you ever go into that kind of analysis? Or you just say I'm just here for the experience, bro.
Dan GreenbergGuest
24:50
I mean it's interesting, but yeah, it's a little bit. So I work more sort of on the public equity product side versus like private equity. Right, you're like going in ripping balance sheets apart. Yeah figure out like valuations, that kind of stuff.
David SyvertsenHost
25:03
Yes, but the growth of it. Can you compare this to CrossFit at all? Like, do you compare this to CrossFit, or more the Spartan race? And I'm going to ask you why I'm asking that in a sec.
Dan GreenbergGuest
25:12
People are asking me like what is this? How would you? It's like kind of a Spartan race meets.
David SyvertsenHost
25:19
Cross. I ask myself all the time, how big will this be? And I want more people from Bison doing this next year. I really want us to push. We had about 22 signed up. I think 18 did it or 19 did it, but I think that number is going to be twice as high next year. And the debate I ask myself all the time is will this be as big in five years? Because CrossFit has sustained a pretty big growth. I feel they flatlined a little bit, but that's still a pretty big growth. I feel they flatlined a little bit, but that's still a pretty big program.
25:47
Where, to me, spartan race. Did you ever do a Spartan race? No, so they were. They were like same thing, they like what's that, what's that? And people signing up. It was massive and everyone was doing one, but then it's like all right, I don't want to do that again. You know like I don't want to do it a third time, a fourth time, a fifth time. I'm really curious to see. Can you compare? Do you have any thoughts on how long you think this craze, this fad, will last with High Rocks?
Dan GreenbergGuest
26:12
In some ways I think it's a little less approachable than CrossFit, in some ways more approachable. So don't have like a scale like you're going to run, even if you're doing it, you gonna run five miles yeah, sorry if you do it. Or walk, or walk right, um versus murph. There's like a thousand ways you could break that up and scale it. Do half murph, right, you know, do whatever kneeling, push-ups, um, but it's lower skill and more grit yep so you don't need to learn how to like olympic lift.
26:41
I was like with mike w right earlier. He's like I've done overhead squat three times. By the way, he's like overhead squats better than I do after 11 years got great mobility for um big beefy dude but yeah, like they're not things that you've never done before, like there's not a lot of high skill movements like double unders, ring muscle, uh, exactly, handstand like that right and like kidding aside, like I don't go into CrossFitters versus High Rocks it's fun to talk about and debate.
David SyvertsenHost
27:07
But I do question, like CrossFitters to me are fitter in that they have to do more things to get to the peak, but I wouldn't say they're better athletes or make more capable, because the High Rocks, the elite High Rocks guys, like what they run and what they're able to do over and over is really impressive to me.
27:25
But I question whether or not High Rocks should ever switch up some of the stations in time. Because let's say you do this two or three times and you're kind of like all right, been there, done that. But if they switch up four of the stations, that might pull you back in and I wonder if there is a way for them to come up with maybe a few different versions of high rocks or switch up two movements every two years. That kind of thing. And it's like something that you anticipate and you see, because it is a very different training regimen than or competition across. It is cross, it is the unknown and unknowable right, like you show up and you don't know what you're going to do. High rocks is you know exactly what you're doing and at some point you've kind of hit that peak, do you see? Would you do another one, especially if they signed up, if they changed up two or three of the movements?
Dan GreenbergGuest
28:12
Oh for sure, yeah, and I'd probably do it single again. Probably would do it in New York. I don't really go out of state for it. Let me ask you a question. It probably corresponds a little bit closer to what you guys are doing at Outlast with skiing, the runners rowing, no Olympic lifting.
David SyvertsenHost
28:39
Yeah, exactly, doing high rocks next year outlast probably gives you more bang for your buck because everything here can essentially be applied where, like if we do squat snatch day, it's not as applicable to a high rocks race, um, and you would say that about a lot of the workouts, especially with some of the higher skills going upside down, going on the rig.
28:59
So I do think outlast, I would say the tie between an outlast type program and high Rocks is that there's a lower barrier for entry. You can make it as hard as you want, you can make it as easy as you want, but and there's the little less scaling options, you know, or or the need for scaling right In in Outlast type training, just like an Outlast, like you do a squat snatch at the gym, depending on who's there, you might need six options for someone. If you're coaching at bison, if you need to scale a couple of things here at outlast, you basically have a B or C and you go from there. So I do think the outlast training and we do longer workouts as well, um, that's, that's something I don't know if, how often you trained it leading up to and how often you do this on your own. I mean take the volume of running out right. Working out for an hour to hour and a half straight is difficult.
Dan GreenbergGuest
29:50
Oh, it's hard and you're just not used to it.
David SyvertsenHost
29:52
Yeah, and I always say, like my inner Chris Henshaw says whatever time domain you're trying to train, you need to work out. You need to really work out at two to two and a half that to get your peak. So that means like if you're trying to get to the elite level of high rocks, you gotta get used to working for two, three hours at a time. And that's who can do that.
Dan GreenbergGuest
30:12
I think, uh, I mean, I, I did, uh, maybe it was doing 800 meter runs instead of a thousand. I think I did seven of those one Saturday, or one Saturday Sunday. Um, it was. I mean, I think even with your marathon prepping, like there's a ramp up, yeah, maybe you run 18 miles before you do the actual, you know, 26 um but yeah, I felt like I had enough. But towards the end it starts to drag and again the best comp I can probably give is murph right like those can drag on, they can.
30:40
it gets and it gets tired and you want to walk sometimes, yep.
David SyvertsenHost
30:44
Now would you do? You know right now if you can do this again.
Dan GreenbergGuest
30:49
Yeah, if it's in New York next year, I'll definitely do it.
David SyvertsenHost
30:51
Would this be something you'd be like? You know what it's like, murph? I'm just going to do this every year until I get sick of it, kind of thing. Yeah.
Dan GreenbergGuest
30:59
Would you ever do partner, if it?
David SyvertsenHost
31:00
lined up schedule wise, your date. Oh, I was going to add, I was going to put you with Alondra. Alondra is an athlete here at Bison who she won the women's pro individual division and the more I I watch her, the more I respect just uh. I mean, this girl just works out all day, I mean, and she's got a career as well, but in her free time she's hiking, biking, crossfitting, lifting at different gyms. It's really impressive and I think, because she works out so much, like the volume in which she works out is incredible. That's a huge reason why she's so good at these races. You know, working out for an hour to hour, 10 for her is just like okay that's what I do three, four days a week, in addition to some other things.
31:40
Where's your head out now, now that it's over? Is it like, hey, I want to see if I could train and push a little bit more? It's like, hey, I'll see you next year. I'm just going back, do my thing.
Dan GreenbergGuest
31:49
I think, I think this year is setting a baseline, and then you always want to be better than so you are going to try to get better at this, for sure, and and maybe I used golf earlier as an analogy but you play a course once you don't really know it, Like we played it once you start to learn some of the like hey, I would do this differently, Great analogy, yeah, exactly.
David SyvertsenHost
32:07
Doing it in Dallas and then doing it in New York this past week. I can say I had a much different experience in that the first time you're doing it, everything is new to you, just like. That's a great analogy with a new golf course Like you just don't know where the dog is, where the trap is over here, what this green is like. But the second time, going in, it was a lot you just knew to expect. Right, and that alone makes you faster. And then again you run five seconds faster per lap. Like that alone is going to take one, two minutes off your time. So I think that's a really cool thing to do twice to try to beat your time space. Yeah, to try to beat your time. Um, does this change anything about your perception of programming? Like, do you ever want to bias yourself more towards this? Like more inclusive, not as mobility based, it's not as high skill. Like, could you see yourself doing more of this programming and less of the CrossFit stuff, or you're? No, I want that balance of back and forth.
Dan GreenbergGuest
33:03
I think the balance is right. Yeah, I've done a lot of different things and this is what fits me right now. Right, and something changes, you know.
David SyvertsenHost
33:10
Do you do this to keep your head spinning, keep yourself motivated. You're a very intrinsically motivated guy. I don't think you need extra motivation, but do you?
Dan GreenbergGuest
33:27
for the people out there that are kind of on the fence. What does signing up for something like this do to you, just to kind of keep you in the game a little bit more? I mean, I think it's a challenge, right, like why do you wake up at five or six in the morning to like do a hard work? It's not because, I mean I think there's something that's said about the hardest thing you do all day is the first thing you do all day yeah.
33:49
And so putting this out there you know it's going to be a long struggle there's a sense of satisfaction that you did this. At the end. Again, going out to brunch and having two brunches is a nice perk. That's like reward yourself?
David SyvertsenHost
33:54
Were you thinking about it during the race? Because sometimes I do it.
Dan GreenbergGuest
33:56
Yeah, no, I had two things picked out.
David SyvertsenHost
33:59
Get that brunch ready for me. That makes you run a little bit faster, yeah, closing thoughts on any advice. If you had a group of people sitting in front of you right now that they don't sign up for much stuff they don't the Bison Bowl, the Bison Brawl, our local competition, the local 5K they don't sign up for stuff. But there's something in their head that's saying like, hey, maybe you could do it too. Do you have any advice for them to kind of get them over the hump, to say like, hey, just give it a shot.
Dan GreenbergGuest
34:29
I think this is different from like a local comp in a couple of different ways right? Local comps usually shorter workouts, then it's like hurry up and wait.
34:36
Yeah, and you sit around, then you get a warmup again, yeah, so I think this is probably probably more work. Just, you know straight through, absolutely yeah. And what I would say is like the programming here whether it's, you know, bison or Outlast like this is what you need to train for this, and you totally got it. Like, definitely get some miles in on the running, yeah, but everything you need to prepare for this is like what you're doing every day.
David SyvertsenHost
35:04
Would you rather? This is different for everyone, but if you had to choose, would you rather put more effort into the aerobic side, the running side being sustainable, or would you be like hey, I think the strength is actually what really helped me at these stations, right, Because some of these people that are not as strong as you, those stations take everything out of them. Do you think there's a bias? Again, you have to be jack of all trades when you do stuff like this, but is there one that you think helps the other more than the other?
Dan GreenbergGuest
35:30
I think it's probably easy to be a better runner and then get some of the strength, and vice versa.
David SyvertsenHost
35:36
Yeah, it takes longer to get strong.
Dan GreenbergGuest
35:38
But yeah, yeah, yeah, so would I do, maybe if I. But yeah, yeah, yeah, so would I do, maybe if I would I do differently.
David SyvertsenHost
35:44
If you had someone like just in front of you. He was like hey, like I'm not a great runner, should I lift more or should I just try to get really good at running, because at some point you don't want to turn this into I can't run anymore, like, and that could come from hey, I'm just not aerobically driven or I'm using so much ammo on these stations. If you feel like it's more like I, the reason I'm bringing this up is because I think the strength component to high rocks is overlooked yeah and I saw this when I was watching the elite men go.
36:15
Okay, during ashley's race, the, the pro men, individuals, are going and I just got used to watching. You know, ashley's group is all women in doubles, so just so many women run together and they're laughing, they're on the matching outfits and they're having a good time. All of a sudden, like these guys are just like sprinting. But one thing I noticed about them like most, if not all of them, like they bench press, like they they're, like some of them are pretty yoked, like pretty big dudes. And then it makes sense to me because I did the open division, you did the open division, you did the open division, right Open. Now, imagine the weights were tougher. Probably wouldn't slow you down that much and um, but that takes a lot out of you unless you're strong and crossfitters love to make fun of hierarchies. They're not strong. But I'll tell you what maybe they can't snatch and they can't clean, but they're not weak dudes.
Dan GreenbergGuest
37:01
I and they can't clean, but they're not weak dudes. I maybe came in a little complacent. I'm like you know I'm not going to win any running races, but you know these like tall, skinny twins and there are a lot of them there I'm like you know I'm going to get you on the sled. Push I swat. I was a little humbled that how fit. You know you don't need to do CrossFit to be super fit, like whatever these people were doing.
David SyvertsenHost
37:27
I'm sure a lot of them do do CrossFit or F45 or something like that, but again, I don't want people to overlook the strength component to being, you know, an improved high rocks athlete. Let's say, for the 20 people that are doing high rocks next year like, yes, I know, run this, split this, but if you get stronger, I think it takes less juice out of you for your run. So I think you have to really do focus in on strength, and I've watched some of these elite guys and girls on Instagram like they lift. They lift a lot of weights. They don't move well and they don't snatch, they don't clean, they don't do toes, bar muscle ups, but they're strong athletes and I think that means a lot for anyone that is on the fence of doing this. If you think you're strong but not a good runner, it's okay, because I think you can bounce that out over time.
38:10
Dan, any closing thoughts on High Rocks, nyc 2025? Will you ever do the Pro Division? Is that something that's in your scope? It's a whole different time commitment, by the way, or it's like hey, I like having this as a you know, just one per year kind of Murph type thing for me.
Dan GreenbergGuest
38:26
You know, I think, uh, the first person in the, the uh open division is 30 minutes ahead of you Time-wise, I think. I think, a little humility, I'd probably stick in the core uh core division unless, um, you know, maybe maybe as a partner you can do pro.
David SyvertsenHost
38:40
But it's probably not necessary to do pro. It's just not going to make you feel better because you did it right.
Dan GreenbergGuest
38:46
Yeah, it's close to an hour and a half. Like do I need more work? I'm probably pretty good.
David SyvertsenHost
38:50
And we say this all the time here at Bison is you don't always need to pursue level one or pursue RX. You can simply just do your shit faster.
Dan GreenbergGuest
38:58
Yeah, and those 14 pound wall balls were real nice.
David SyvertsenHost
39:01
That were. Did you do yesterday's bison workout, the wall ball, sumo burpee? Yeah, it felt a little heavier. The ball felt so heavy I was like I'm never using a 14 pound ball again. All right, well, dan, thanks for the time. Busy guy here on a weekend and you know he already worked out and came back and did this interview with us. Really appreciative of your time. Appreciative of your time and definitely going to try to have you back on, talk about some of the other things, maybe with you and Matt, talk about that injury and talk about how you bounce back, because what you're doing right now.
39:30
I'm really impressed by Thank you. All right, thanks, guys. Thanks for having me. We'll see you next week. Thank you, everybody for taking the time out of your day to listen to the Hurt Fit Podcast. Be on the lookout for next week's episode.
